Feedback - FROWNS

[pankaj21]

Seems that post was missed by the mods... :(

[Rakesh J.V]

But in Kolkata , Nikon Service center asks for either of one . They even know the big shop names and they know they do not provide bill , they just stamp the warranty card with Shop Seal . So they give full warranty with the stamped warranty card only . This is for all Nikon Camera and Lenses.

I'd like to know what they'd do when faced with the prospect of an expensive repair ..... stick by Nikon India's rules or go with 'local understanding'.

I think it would be the former as over a certain cost, they'll need their supervisors approval (I assume they have such systems in place).

Here are Nikon India's rules on their website: http://www.nikon.co.in/en_IN/warranty.page

Actually, same thing happened for me at the Richmond road service centre. Got my D7000's sensor cleaned and calibrated for a back focus issue for free. They just checked the stamped warranty card (explained that i had left the bill at Chennai).

[VikramF]

But in Kolkata , Nikon Service center asks for either of one . They even know the big shop names and they know they do not provide bill , they just stamp the warranty card with Shop Seal . So they give full warranty with the stamped warranty card only . This is for all Nikon Camera and Lenses.

I'd like to know what they'd do when faced with the prospect of an expensive repair ..... stick by Nikon India's rules or go with 'local understanding'.

I think it would be the former as over a certain cost, they'll need their supervisors approval (I assume they have such systems in place).

Here are Nikon India's rules on their website: http://www.nikon.co.in/en_IN/warranty.page

[ras]

I'm sorry I'd have to agree with the seller more. If the seller declared that the item is without bill, it is fair that he bought the lens 2 years back and that's what he was aware of. Whether the lens was bought gray was something that should have been clear when the seller said 'no bill'.

So, "No bill" always means grey? Or can it also mean that the bill cannot be found or is lost?

"No Bill" means that Nikon India will treat it exactly as it would a grey item (viz. you would need to pay for all repairs/servicing).

Nikon India, not only needs the original bill, but also the warranty card. BOTH need to be presented together (just one or the other will not suffice). They may consider exceptions - but those will only be exceptions and not thought of as a rule.

This is confirmed many times from Nikon Service on Richmond Road Bangalore and here's what their site says:
2) To validate this warranty card, you are requested to fill in all necessary information (owner's name, address, telephone number, e-mail address and date of purchase) on the front. This warranty card together with the original purchase receipt must be presented to the Nikon authorized service facility before any repair can be made under warranty.

I feel the need to clarify this for all those who buy Nikon equipment under the impression that it's under warranty when it's advertised as "with warranty card but can't find bill" or "Scanned copy of bill available" ..... it's not. It's exactly the same as buying an item without a bill or warranty.

As the warranty kicks in only from the date of sale and as items sometimes lie in stock for 2+ years, Nikon India needs BOTH bill and warranty.

PS: Writing this here as the other day I got a call from a fellow member who bought an item from a well known store in Burma Market and was assured by the shop keeper that as he had the warranty card stamped, there wasn't a need for a bill (that's how the shop reduced the price - to avoid tax). To Nikon India - that is still a grey item and they won't honour the warranty.

But in Kolkata , Nikon Service center asks for either of one . They even know the big shop names and they know they do not provide bill , they just stamp the warranty card with Shop Seal . So they give full warranty with the stamped warranty card only . This is for all Nikon Camera and Lenses. Even I had the similar idea that one needs both to be presented at the time of claim , but last time I was in Nikon to Service one of my lenses and I produced a stamped Warranty card of my D700 , they said "yes, we accept this for any warranty claim we know this shop does not provide bill. "

[VikramF]

I'm sorry I'd have to agree with the seller more. If the seller declared that the item is without bill, it is fair that he bought the lens 2 years back and that's what he was aware of. Whether the lens was bought gray was something that should have been clear when the seller said 'no bill'.

So, "No bill" always means grey? Or can it also mean that the bill cannot be found or is lost?

"No Bill" means that Nikon India will treat it exactly as it would a grey item (viz. you would need to pay for all repairs/servicing).

Nikon India, not only needs the original bill, but also the warranty card. BOTH need to be presented together (just one or the other will not suffice). They may consider exceptions - but those will only be exceptions and not thought of as a rule.

This is confirmed many times from Nikon Service on Richmond Road Bangalore and here's what their site says:
2) To validate this warranty card, you are requested to fill in all necessary information (owner's name, address, telephone number, e-mail address and date of purchase) on the front. This warranty card together with the original purchase receipt must be presented to the Nikon authorized service facility before any repair can be made under warranty.

I feel the need to clarify this for all those who buy Nikon equipment under the impression that it's under warranty when it's advertised as "with warranty card but can't find bill" or "Scanned copy of bill available" ..... it's not. It's exactly the same as buying an item without a bill or warranty.

As the warranty kicks in only from the date of sale and as items sometimes lie in stock for 2+ years, Nikon India needs BOTH bill and warranty.

PS: Writing this here as the other day I got a call from a fellow member who bought an item from a well known store in Burma Market and was assured by the shop keeper that as he had the warranty card stamped, there wasn't a need for a bill (that's how the shop reduced the price - to avoid tax). To Nikon India - that is still a grey item and they won't honour the warranty.

[zack2137]

So, "No bill" always means grey? Or can it also mean that the bill cannot be found or is lost?

No, but its general prudence to know where the bill and warranty papers are. Not that the buyer is correct in withholding the information, but lack of general prudence puts you in the same shoes. And upon inquiry if you realize that the item never had a bill, it should ring a bell. If at all it didn't, it makes a case for the seller that he bought the lens from a person of his choice and that he never promised/ was aware that the lens is from a more recent batch.

Before I had "nominated my cousin for pre-buying inspection", we had decided that I would do an online transfer to sellers account and he would send lens directly to me via his niece. Would my request for refund have been honored in that case, since I did not get a chance to "inspect" the lens beforehand? Just my luck my cousin could not spot these things during the inspection.

Yes, you had a case there. And frankly so, if it was agreed beforehand that a refund is to be granted if the lens fails a physical inspection. But most ads that I've seen on JJMF put a condition that all inspections have to be made beforehand.
Now nominating your cousin for inspection is as good as you inspecting the glass in person. If he is not proficient with lenses and their functioning, you could have asked the seller to send the lens with his niece, inspect it in person and then pay her niece to be 100% sure of what you are buying.

Having said the above, I believe the seller has misrepresented the item for sale and exploited the inherent limitation of buy-and-sell forums. A case could also be made that the seller himself wasn't aware of the fungal growth, since it never showed on the pictures. What really happened here, is for the mods to decide.

My $$0.02

Anyways zack, thanks for your interesting views and best of luck for your sale deals in the forum :)

Thanks, I'm actually trying to sell a couple of things, using JJMF for the first time! This has garnered my interest somehow! :)

[pankaj21]

Hi,

  I am Arun (forum handle: thelightening). I have to share an experience about a person called Karthik (Infantblue) from Chennai.

  Based on this advertisment http://www.jjmehta.com/forum/index.php?topic=8991.0  , I have called this person up and talked to him about the product he is interested to sell. Based on several calls and PM's we agreed for a price of 3000Rs. He clearly mentioned to me that, he is not interested to courier or ship this to Bangalore from his place, Chennai.

Based on this, I tried all the way and at last found a friends collegue, who used to go to Chennai frequently and requested him with the help of my friend to meet infantblue and complete the deal. It was soo hard to make him agree to get these things done, as its a business deal. Based on the arrangement, I have sent infant blue a detailed mail with all the contact details of mine, my friend and his collegue, then about the lens and everything. That single mail was enough to understand the professionalism of a business deal.

I have handed over the money to my friend collegue even to buy this. I called infantblue a lot of time and he didnt pick, but replied with some 1-2 sms about the confirmations. He told he will meet the guy coming from Bangalore and handover the stuffs.

This is on wed (20th april) , today morning (21Apr), I have got an sms from Karthik (infantblue) as follows;

"Hey, One of my friend is desperate to buy my lens for 3500. Anyway as it is only four thousand there in bang, I believe its not an issue with you, I am extremely sorry"

I am taking this as a kind of cheating and the efforts, calls, PM's what we made and agreed is of no value. Rs 500 is great??? If then he might have not committed for 3000Rs at all.

I have did a lot of transactions with other jjmf members , even after receiving the money in the evening in my account, went out , bought packing materials, packed and shipped before courier guy close his store.... I feel thats commitment. Not this one, at least for 500Rs.

Thats the reason why I am sharing my experience over here and it will help my jjmf forum members. Thanks for your patience to read my whole experience. Hope it helps.

Moderator Note:
It is the judgment of the Moderators that a meeting of the minds between buyer and seller took place. Therefore, a contract was in force, and the same contract was violated by the seller. The seller's account has been blocked, and his thread has been removed.

Similar experience for me too...

I went ahead & dropped a mail to the seller selling a canon 50mm 1.8 for 4000/- at http://www.jjmehta.com/forum/index.php/topic,27663.0.html

he mentioned that he is out of Pune & will hold the lens for me until he comes back. also he mentioned that he had been approached by several others too & will let me know once he is back.

He updated the post as on Hold/booked.

Now yesterday I receive a mail mentioning that he is back, but he was contacted by a buyer who is willing to pay 4500/- for the lens & wanted me to confirm if I am interested for that price. :(

I replied back saying that "I am interested in the lens for the price that was initially quoted in the post"

Now today I see he updated his post with Expected price : 4500/-
Also reason being, the buyer (assuming to be me or many others like me)
backed out.
So basically, its clear that there was no buyer who wanted buy it for 4500/- else he would not have updated the price, rather would have mentioned that the lens is booked for another person.

The buyer might be right, but its all about a person's integrity. He should have studied the market rates before committing it any seller
Not sure, if this is an offense or not but wanted to make reputed members & new joiners to be aware before showing interest in deals....at least with people who have very less reputation (posts might be the wrong word here) on the forum.

Thanks !!

Pankaj

[abhivg]

I'm sorry I'd have to agree with the seller more. If the seller declared that the item is without bill, it is fair that he bought the lens 2 years back and that's what he was aware of. Whether the lens was bought gray was something that should have been clear when the seller said 'no bill'.

So, "No bill" always means grey? Or can it also mean that the bill cannot be found or is lost?

Regarding the fungal growth, again, you nominated a person who was incharged with pre-buying inspection. Maybe the seller cheated you with the no fungus promise (I'm not taking sides here, I'm just assuming if he did), but the mere fact that you got it inspected should be a reason enough to believe that it was as promised on the date of sale.

The incident is unfortunate and rather is a gray area. There is no black and white here.
Since the seller is offering to get the lens serviced, I'd have to side with the seller here! And yes, thanks for those to-dos before buying glasses over the forum. They are very crucial here.

Before I had "nominated my cousin for pre-buying inspection", we had decided that I would do an online transfer to sellers account and he would send lens directly to me via his niece. Would my request for refund have been honored in that case, since I did not get a chance to "inspect" the lens beforehand? Just my luck my cousin could not spot these things during the inspection.

Anyways zack, thanks for your interesting views and best of luck for your sale deals in the forum :)

[zack2137]

My arguments here are that age of the lens was mis represented; actual age is MORE THAN 3 TIMES THE MENTIONED AGE!!! Facts such as white box item and not bought from authorised canon dealer SHOULD HAVE BEEN PUT FORTH IN THE AD ITSELF. Also he said he did not have receipt indicating that he bought it 2 years ago. Considering the fact that incorrect details about the fungus were provided by the seller, I am not sure if he bought it 2 years ago or earlier.

Further, the condition of the lens is misrepresented. Saying that there is no fungus in lens when in fact there is, IS NOT ETHICAL. Also he didnt deny that there is fungal growth, but instead blames the buyer by saying you should have checked it first. Not sure what ethics he is talking about.

I'm sorry I'd have to agree with the seller more. If the seller declared that the item is without bill, it is fair that he bought the lens 2 years back and that's what he was aware of. Whether the lens was bought gray was something that should have been clear when the seller said 'no bill'.

Regarding the fungal growth, again, you nominated a person who was incharged with pre-buying inspection. Maybe the seller cheated you with the no fungus promise (I'm not taking sides here, I'm just assuming if he did), but the mere fact that you got it inspected should be a reason enough to believe that it was as promised on the date of sale.

The incident is unfortunate and rather is a gray area. There is no black and white here.
Since the seller is offering to get the lens serviced, I'd have to side with the seller here! And yes, thanks for those to-dos before buying glasses over the forum. They are very crucial here.

[meandrake]

It is extremely sad to see an unfortunate situation like this developing on the otherwise hugely successful Buy & Sell Forum of JJMPF. However we are not jumping to any conclusions as of yet and a PM has been sent to the seller asking for a few clarifications and till that reply is received I would request the membership from not labelling any member adversely.

There are some interesting observations & cautions I would like to share with the membership but would like to proceed only after a little more data is available from the seller. As we can see, the buyer has already presented all the data from his side but the seller needs to provide us some facts as seen from his viewpoint.

At this point I will just say that all buyers must take ALL possible steps to protect themselves from a bad transaction because the very nature of forum transactions is that if they go bad, there is not much recourse to the buyer to recover his money in most of the cases.

Thanks.